Utah Supreme Courtroom Justice Thomas Lee poses for a photograph contained in the Supreme Courtroom on the Matheson Courthouse in Salt Lake Metropolis on Friday, June 10, 2022. Spenser Heaps, Deseret Information
Utah Supreme Courtroom Justice Thomas Lee poses for a photograph contained in the Supreme Courtroom in Salt Lake Metropolis on Friday, June 10. He retired Thursday after 12 years on the excessive courtroom. Spenser Heaps, Deseret Information
Utah Supreme Courtroom Justice Thomas Lee, 57, poses for a photograph exterior the Supreme Courtroom in Salt Lake Metropolis on Friday, June 10. He retired Thursday after 12 years on the excessive courtroom. Spenser Heaps, Deseret Information
Thomas Lee has at all times stored himself very busy.
When he left a regulation agency in 1997 to work as a professor at Brigham Younger College, he advised his spouse he would have extra free time.
"She sort of smiled and winked at me and stated, 'That sounds nice,' and I might inform she had one thing in thoughts," recalled Lee, who retired Thursday as affiliate chief justice on the Utah Supreme Courtroom.
"I stated, 'Why do you may have that look in your face?' And he or she stated, 'Nicely, I do not actually imagine you.'"
Lee stated his spouse, Kim, was proper. He continued training regulation on the aspect and stayed simply as busy as he had ever been. Throughout his time on the Utah Supreme Courtroom, he continued instructing courses on the aspect at Harvard, Chicago and BYU regulation faculties.
"I assume I similar to to be busy," he stated. "I like the regulation. I am simply actually passionate concerning the regulation and the way necessary it's."
And when he just lately determined to depart the Utah Supreme Courtroom and begin not one, however two non-public corporations along with persevering with to show college courses, Lee stated he did not even attempt to inform his spouse that he could be much less busy.
Kim Lee stated her husband is at all times very succesful it doesn't matter what he does, and this subsequent step in his life will likely be a chance to mix numerous his many experiences and abilities. It is a step that she and her household are enthusiastic about, however none greater than Thomas Lee.
Utah Supreme Courtroom
Lee met Chief Justice Matthew Durrant earlier than he entered regulation college whereas working a summer time job on the agency the place Durrant labored. Lee stated folks he met by that have, together with Durrant, helped him determine that he wished to spend his profession in Utah.
Durrant stated Lee was at all times very respectful of different opinions whereas on the courtroom, which is a vital trait.
"He makes the hassle to essentially be certain that he understands the opposing view. So … you at all times really feel you are heard, even when finally you may disagree on the difficulty," Durrant stated.
He stated Lee improved each opinion he participated in, whether or not he was the creator of the opinion or whether or not he was fastidiously reviewing and including to what another person wrote.
"He is a particularly laborious employee, and actually an excellent scholar and a jurist," the chief justice stated.
He additionally referred to as Lee an exquisite colleague.
Lee stated he did not understand when becoming a member of the excessive courtroom as a choose how necessary it's for the opposite justices who else is appointed due to how intently you're employed collectively.
"We're a collegial physique and every little thing we do is finished by majority vote — and never simply majority vote, but when somebody disagrees with you, they're in all probability going to write down about it in a printed opinion. ... It may trigger numerous work and numerous stress and numerous anxiousness if the courtroom is not functioning effectively," Lee stated.
In a collegial physique just like the Utah Supreme Courtroom, he stated dissenting and differing views must be welcomed. And Lee believes that in his time on the bench, the courtroom fulfilled that objective.
Utah Supreme Courtroom Justice Thomas Lee poses for a photograph contained in the Supreme Courtroom in Salt Lake Metropolis on Friday, June 10. He retired Thursday after 12 years on the excessive courtroom.
Spenser Heaps, Deseret Information
"I believe we're good at listening to one another. After we determine our instances, it is in a convention the place it is simply the 5 of us in a room and it is an actual debate. And generally it's going to go on for hours," he stated.
Kim Lee stated she knew her husband could be a great Supreme Courtroom justice as a result of he's detail-oriented, and cares about getting issues proper.
"He works tougher than anyone I do know. I believe he works actually laborious as a result of he cares rather a lot about ensuring … if his identify is on one thing, it will replicate, , the analysis he is executed and that it is executed proper," she stated.
Utah justice system
Lee, 57, sees many ways in which the state's justice program is excelling however stated he additionally sees room for enchancment, which is a part of the rationale he's beginning two corporations as he retires from the Utah Supreme Courtroom.
One in all his corporations will concentrate on appellate regulation, bringing instances earlier than appellate courts each in Utah and nationally. He stated there are some nice appellate legal professionals in Utah, however there should not many corporations with that specialty.
"It makes a giant distinction to have an appellate specialist in a extremely necessary leading edge case that comes up on attraction," he stated.
Lee stated he can have a associate in that agency, John Nielsen, who argued dozens of instances earlier than him whereas he was on the Utah Supreme Courtroom. Lee stated he was impressed with Nielsen's briefs and displays and even stated Nielsen was one of the best lawyer to seem earlier than the excessive courtroom whereas Lee was on the bench. The agency will likely be based mostly in Utah, however can even have a nationwide attain.
Lee believes one vital means Utah's justice system can enhance is by serving to extra folks have entry to the system — one thing he stated the courts have been engaged on and making progress in, together with giving paralegals alternatives to deal with some authorized points themselves in a particular program. Lee stated it is not simply the decrease class, however typically the center class that may be priced out of the justice system.
He stated Utah's courtroom system is a frontrunner on this space, and has created an innovation workplace devoted to engaged on methods to make authorized assist extra accessible.
"I believe we're making some progress there. I believe there's numerous work to do," Lee stated.
Corpus linguistics? What’s that?
Lee stated many questions within the regulation rely on how the general public would perceive a phrase or a phrase, and far of what a choose does is resolve ambiguity in language, whether or not that's Utah code or a contract.
"We take an oath to be goal, to be impartial, and we've got to indicate our math once we make our selections," he stated.
He stated judges will typically cite the dictionary, however in some instances the dictionary can have a number of contradictory meanings. For instance, Utah code says it's a crime to "discharge" a firearm in sure circumstances, and in a single case it was unclear if discharge meant taking one shot or unloading a complete journal.
Whereas Lee was on the Utah Supreme Courtroom, he had a regulation clerk who had a level in linguistics and stored speaking about corpus linguistics. To resolve this situation, they checked out corpus linguistics, or how the phrase is being utilized by the inhabitants, which confirmed that when folks use the phrase discharge when referring to a gun, it nearly at all times means one shot.
Lee stated, initially, different members of the excessive courtroom weren't very welcoming of this new strategy of thought and even talked about in a short that they thought it was going exterior of their duty as a courtroom and doing "fact-finding," which is the duty of legal professionals. However Lee argued it was one other means of deciphering the regulation, which is their duty.
"Proper at first, my colleagues not solely did not be part of my opinion, they added some issues to their opinion to criticize what I used to be doing and to recommend that perhaps it was even judicially unethical to do what I used to be doing," Lee recalled. "Now all 5 of us are on board with utilizing these instruments."
Durrant stated that as they realized extra about it, the judges are extra snug utilizing corpus linguistics as a technique to interpret the regulation. He stated it will probably typically present extra concerning the supposed which means of a regulation than a dictionary.
Utah Supreme Courtroom Justice Thomas Lee, 57, poses for a photograph exterior the Supreme Courtroom in Salt Lake Metropolis on Friday, June 10. He retired Thursday after 12 years on the excessive courtroom.
Spenser Heaps, Deseret Information
Not simply the courts in Utah, however courts from across the nation are utilizing corpus linguistics in selections, together with Decide Kathryn Kimball Mizelle who used it when placing down a masks mandate within the Center District of Florida based mostly on the corpus linguistics of the phrase sanitation. Lee stated even U.S. Supreme Courtroom justices have requested about corpus linguistics as a attainable technique to resolve a case.
"It's extremely thrilling to me. It is one of many the reason why I am motivated to do that as a substitute of to hitch a giant regulation agency," Lee stated.
He stated he has confidence that it will develop even additional.
Lee stated his second new agency will concentrate on linguistics and assist seek the advice of legal professionals all through the nation about linguistics. Members of the agency can even be accessible to testify in courtroom when requested about linguistics debates in instances. Lee's associate, Jesse Egbert, presently works as a linguistics professor at Northern Arizona College, and the 2 have labored collectively on displays for linguistics conferences.
Household, regulation and soccer
Kim Lee stated that as their kids obtained older, they might discuss a few of her husband's instances and his position and it had a optimistic impact on the household, each due to what they realized and thru the connections he made.
She stated her husband would maintain mock courts at their kids's faculties, or invite courses or Scouting teams to the courtroom to speak concerning the judicial system.
He additionally has been a mentor for a lot of regulation clerks, and Kim Lee stated these two or three regulation clerks from every of the 12 years he was on the Utah Supreme Courtroom have grow to be a part of their household.
"These relationships keep, and I believe that is one of many neatest elements of the job," she stated.
Lee stated the transfer away from the excessive courtroom is primarily monetary and can assist him pay for his kids to get by faculty. He stated he's grateful for his wage and advantages from his time on the courtroom, however legal professionals working for the federal government often take pay cuts.
Two of the Lees' kids have determined to hunt regulation levels. And whereas Thomas Lee stated he has beloved his time working in regulation, he tries to current an correct image of the expertise to his kids to verify they're conscious of the pressures and stresses concerned within the profession.
Ben Lee graduated this yr from Harvard Legislation Faculty and begins a clerkship on the District of Columbia Circuit this fall. He stated his father has been an instance for him, and he respects how his dad cares about his jobs and the way he performs them.
"I believe he actually cares about what is true, and what's true. And that is what drives how he decides each opinion, how he writes each opinion. He isn't swayed by, , 'How is that this going to make me look?' or issues like that. He cares about his oath that he took to the U.S. Structure and to the Utah Structure. And I believe that's what everybody would hope for in a choose — somebody who's dedicated to the integrity of the regulation," Ben Lee stated.
Thomas Lee stated he's way more snug being in a judicial place than being a politician like his brother, Utah Sen. Mike Lee.
"There's just one brother within the Lee household, Rex Lee's sons, that was ever going to be a politician and it was not Tom — and I say that out of nice respect for Mike. He is so good with folks. He is so snug being within the public eye, talking publicly about … what he thinks. I am way more snug in a convention room with 4 different folks," Thomas Lee stated.
Rex Lee served as U.S. solicitor normal within the Eighties, was the founding dean of BYU's regulation college, and served as BYU's president from 1989-1995.
Though his brother is extra outspoken on political points than he's, Thomas Lee stated the sisters within the household make each him and his brother "appear to be shrinking violets," and in-laws will generally stroll away throughout household conversations due to how loud it will get.
"It is numerous enjoyable, truly. We generally disagree, and we at all times have enjoyable collectively and at all times have sort of raucous discussions about no matter," Lee stated.
He stated since his brother is a senator, they extra typically have political conversations, however the conversations about BYU soccer or their hobbies can get fairly loud as effectively.